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Poster: hseamons Date: Sep 21, 2011 8:06pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: breaking (up) news - CRAZY (TRUE) STORY.

But the whole point here is how RANDOM the events are. Why would I care in the LEAST about REM in my dreams? REM was not thinking about me and I was not thinking about REM - the same was true for the other event, except my friend was probably thinking about me while I was sleeping, but not me of him (consciously)....


BTW, I don't know if it's because of the many live shows I listen to or not, but I tend to have lots of dreams about being at live concerts and there are tons of people in the dream. Do other people have lots of live concert dreams here? They are SO intense.

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Poster: ringolevio Date: Sep 21, 2011 8:53pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: breaking (up) news - CRAZY (TRUE) STORY.

Well, but see, first you say this was totally random, then you tell us you dream about live concerts all the time. So it doesn't really seem like such a big coincidence if you happened to dream about REM.

The other explanation is that our brains rearrange the details of things afterwards to make them make more sense. We're just wired to do that. So today you say it's amazing that you dreamed about REM last night, but maybe you've rewritten it just a little in your mind - maybe you dreamed about REM a few nights ago, not just last night? Not saying that's the case, just that there's usually a rational (boring) explanation for these seemingly amazing things.

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Poster: hseamons Date: Sep 21, 2011 9:21pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: breaking (up) news - CRAZY (TRUE) STORY.

No! Dreams are not rational by any means, and I PROMISE you, I dreamed about REM LAST night, or this morning to be more precise. The point is that we are more aware of the "collective unconscious" in our dreams, so what is being channeled in other people's minds can be received and transformed in the mind of the dreamer, like a radio receiver that can also alter the image at the same time. There have been thorough studies on this reality. We cannot RATIONALLY explain these incidences; we can only describe these profound - and, yes, truly, unequivocally amazing - coincidences.



This post was modified by hseamons on 2011-09-22 04:21:35

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Poster: ringolevio Date: Sep 22, 2011 5:10am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: breaking (up) news - CRAZY (TRUE) STORY.

Okay, relax, I believe you. I don't really believe in a "collective unconscious," though, in some magical sense. It's more like, we've all seen all the same television programs for decades now. Our "collective unconscious" is a grab bag of snippets we saw on TV, on the Internet, in the tabloid headlines etc. We file random stuff away in our brains that doesn't mean much at the time, but gets regurgitated when something later reminds us of it.

So possibly the reason you dreamed about REM and the reason REM made big news headlines the next day is one and the same: maybe some snippets or hints about this actually leaked out a few days before - from people connected to the band, perhaps? the way gossip will do - and you noticed it without thinking much of it, if the band interests you. If you looked around online, you might find that hints were dropped that the band was going to make an announcement.

Also, if you just look at the statistics of "coincidence," they turn out not usually to be very surprising. If you really dream about live concerts frequently, and you like REM, odds are you're going to dream about REM at some point. The statistical possibility of your dreaming about a particular band on the same day that band makes a public announcement is not so remote as it might seem.

And if you then consider all the OTHER bands you've apparently dreamed about, and consider that every other time you've dreamed about a band, they did NOT make a big announcement the next day, this particular event stops seeming so amazing. EVENTUALLY you were going to dream about a band that made a big announcement in the news around the same time you dreamed about them.

Sorry to be a wet blanket :)

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Poster: hseamons Date: Sep 22, 2011 12:09pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: breaking (up) news - CRAZY (TRUE) STORY.

NO! It is not simply regurgitation because so much in a dream is radically different and reflects environments and people we have never encountered. IT INVOLVES IMAGINATION TOO! I had this one beautiful dream where I was laying on the very edge of a mountain, the drop-off was to my very right, and a pool of water at the very left. There was a waterfall coming down the mountain and there were stars in the sky. Very heavenly feel to it.

Last night I recall a dream where I was at a party - again I have lots of "large gathering" dreams - and I had a white umbrella that folded up in a very star-like way. I would open it up and spin it in the air, and sometimes almost hit people with it accidentally. Later, my brother walks up to me in my dream with a small box of small, round buttons, or pins to wear. I noticed a bunch of them were just white circles. Another one was a half-black and half white circle with a silver edging around it, which was the one I picked. There were also yellow buttons and other colored buttons.

What's weird about all of this is that I just this week started reading a book by Jung where he talks about mandalas and circular shapes as being symbolic in dreams of the inner self. I thought that I never really have mandala dreams, just all these large crowd dreams. BUT THEN - LAST NIGHT - the white umbrella and the buttons manifest as very symbolic realities in my dream, which Jung would relate to the mandala as an ancient, oft-recurring spiritual/psychological image that appears in our dreams. But maybe I am only dreaming these circular symbols because I'm reading about them now - or maybe - JUST MAYBE - Jung is teaching me to notice them more in my dreams.




This post was modified by hseamons on 2011-09-22 19:09:14

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Poster: ringolevio Date: Sep 22, 2011 11:49am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: breaking (up) news - CRAZY (TRUE) STORY.

I didn't say dreams just regurgitation - I said that small snippets of information that our brain files away probably explain a lot of the supposed coincidences in dreams. Of course dreams also involve imagination! What I am saying doesn't mean they don't have any meaning; it just means they probably aren't actually prophetic or anything - the appearance of this is usually our minds playing tricks on us. They still have a lot of personal significance.

Your dream sounds pretty cool. I do think you're likely dreaming about mandalas because you're reading Jung; but if you're into that stuff, I don't expect you to see it my way :)

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Poster: hseamons Date: Sep 22, 2011 12:19pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: breaking (up) news - CRAZY (TRUE) STORY.

Why do you not dig Jung, overall? Is there a specific psychological viewpoint/theory you prefer instead? I'd love to hear about it. I am not a "Jungian" by any means, but I find a bunch of his ideas helpful.

Also, I agree that dreams are generally not "prophetic," but I think they often can be revealing in terms of connecting us with a larger, interconnected psychic reality. I don't think we are wholly isolated in our interior world.

This post was modified by hseamons on 2011-09-22 19:19:08

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Poster: ringolevio Date: Sep 22, 2011 5:44pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: breaking (up) news - CRAZY (TRUE) STORY.

Oh, I agree we are connected psychologically, I just don't care for the mystical stuff in Jung.

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Poster: rastamon Date: Sep 22, 2011 7:19pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: breaking (up) news - CRAZY (TRUE) STORY.

REM also means Rapid Eye Movement and going into the dream state. I'll have to talk to Don Juan & Don Genero about that tonight

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Poster: Jim F Date: Sep 21, 2011 10:11pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: breaking (up) news - CRAZY (TRUE) STORY.

I had a dream once that I was Benjamin Franklin. When I woke up I kinda shook my head and thought "Ben Franklin...huh, wonder where that one came from?" Then I noticed I had fallen asleep with the tv on and the History channel was airing a documentary about Ben Franklin. That's why I don't like to sleep with a television on, stuff gets programmed in there. Better to fall asleep to music.

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Poster: ringolevio Date: Sep 22, 2011 5:27am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: breaking (up) news - CRAZY (TRUE) STORY.

LOL! Exactly. Our dreams are much more "History channel" than "collective unconscious," especially since we are often falling asleep watching it ...

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Poster: rdenirojb87 Date: Sep 21, 2011 8:13pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: breaking (up) news - CRAZY (TRUE) STORY.

I've had some dreams where I've been at a live show. I can never tell what damn year it is though. They are pretty awesome. When the dream starts, it just begins in the middle of the show though! I never get to see the opener or the encore! I just appear in the middle of the show and then wake the fuck up when I take a spill down the stairs trying to make it to the bathroom. I never find out what show I was at. Very frustrating.

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Poster: ringolevio Date: Sep 21, 2011 8:50pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: breaking (up) news - CRAZY (TRUE) STORY.

that's pretty funny.